Cindy’s Fred’s Steak
** note June 2019 – This post is from 2013 and the general consensus is that the recipes below do not produce an authentic Fred’s Steak. Further suggestions & tweaks towards reproduction are found in the comments.**
During my Palo Alto days I discovered Fred’s Steak. Fred’s Steak needs no introduction to the initiated, but for those who are not I point you to a Wiki article and recommend checking out the links as well.
If you followed the link, you will note that it says
The marinade is a secret, though some imitations have been listed on the Internet, here’s one:
Ingredients
Flyer from Schaub’s Meat, Fish & Poultry about Fred’s Steaks.
- 1-1/2 cup brewed coffee
- 1 cup red wine
- 1/2 cup olive oil
- 1/2 cup molasses
- 1/3 cup Balsamic vinegar
- 1/3 cup Tamari sauce
- 1/3 cup Worcestershire sauce
- 2 Tbsp chili powder
- 6 cloves garlic
A search around the internet finds this exact recipe on cyclingforums.com (click link for recipe). But more searching around the internet reveals variations on the famous marinade. A few examples can be found on
As the recipe is a fast kept secret of the famous Schaub’s Meat, Fish and Poultry Market, on which of these recipes am I to base my attempt?
As a scientist with experience in Big Data, I am naturally inclined to compare as many recipes as I can to discover the core of the dish. In my wildest dreams a website such as http://www.recipecomparison.com would magically pull all of these up and give me the answer, yet, alas, none were in that database. So, using my powers of observation, I went at it manually.
I found that the 4 recipes above use slightly similar ingredients in varying quantities and sources. However, the Burdenslanding recipe (published in 2009) is almost exactly like the Cycling recipe (2003), so they have somewhat equal weight. Here is how the ingredients pan out
OK then! Garlic, coffee, oil and chili and I’m good to go – but I have the other ingredients as well, and have some of my own substitutions up my sleeve – so here is what I did. I bring you
Cindy’s Fred’s Steak
Marinate Tri-tip for 2-4 days in a plastic bag in the fridge in the following.
In roughly equal portions
- Brewed coffee
- Red wine
- Worcestershire sauce
- Molasses
- Black vinegar
- Olive oil
- Brown sugar
Less of
- Chili bean sauce
- Guajillo chili powder
- Cocoa powder
- Black pepper
- Liquid smoke
- Minced garlic
- Salt
Cook as you would tri-tip: bake or BBQ but don’t skimp on the horseradish cream sauce (another comparison recipe coming soon!).
Garden and Eats 
Was it any good?
Yes, I think the steak is good, but alas, I have not been able to do a side by side comparison with Fred’s so I can’t say how authentic it is. Really enjoy this with potatoes and horseradish cream sauce and asparagus!
This recipe is nothing like Fred’s steak unfortunately. Its way too sweet. Fred’s does not taste of wine or sugar at all. Also the color was all wrong as well. If you look below at “Edubs” version it looks MUCH more like Fred’s steak and has the same smell / aroma as well. I have had my “Edubs” version marinating for a couple days now and am eager to throw it on the grill this week.
Thanks for the feedback! Eager to hear about how Edubs version tastes!
So last night I tried the “Edubs” version and it was MUCH closer to how Fred’s Steak. I used a tri tip and started by cutting away any excess fat from the steak. I think gave a healthy coating of sea salt as the first layer. After that I applied a healthy amount of garlic powder and onion powder and made sure the steak was well coated. All this was done on a cookie sheet. My next step was to lightly coat the steak with the activated food grade charcoal powder which I purchased online (https://www.amazon.com/Activated-Hardwood-Charcoal-Powder-whitening/dp/B06Y6MGLT8) and poured some olive oil on the steak as well. I massaged it all in so the steak was nice and coated. The charcoal is very messy and will get in your finger nails so if you have rubber gloves etc you might want to consider using them. I then put it in a zip lock bag and put it in my make shift tumbler, a rotisserie grill basket but without any heat. I also threw an bag of ice into the grill basket in a separate bag to make sure the steak stayed cool. I did this for a hour or two then took the steak and put it into a vacuum packed bag and let it stay in the fridge for another 3 days. Before I cooked it last night I took it out of the fridge and out of the bag, put it on a cookie sheet and blotted off any excess oil with a paper towel. Let it sit for one hour to get to room temp then threw it on the grill and cooked it just as I would a Fred’s Steak.
I would say it was 85% the way there. Still wasn’t quite as good as Fred’s but it was still better than anything else I have tried. I will continue to smuggle Fred’s Steaks in my suitcase every time I am home visiting family but this recipe is a great alternative when that is not an option and I hope to improve on it!
Thanks for the update. I am hoping someone can try squid ink instead of charcoal at some point. I feel like charcoal is more of a recent food addition while I can see squid ink as being an ingredient from the past. I did a quick “squid ink marinade” search and found another Fred’s steak recipe for further reflection: https://www.chowhound.com/recipes/faux-fred-marinated-tritip-honor-russs-birthday-26665. Ingredients are:
-black bean sauce
-garlic chopped very fine
-olive oil
-salt
-very strong coffee (or water)
-sugar
optional
-cocoa powder
-tamarind paste (or water)
-chipotle powder
-squid ink
As a pandemic project, I worked on reverse-engineering Fred Steak, and I think I’ve gotten pretty close. We even did a side-by-side blind comparisson with friends with the final iteration, and concluded that they were very similar. Here goes:
To make the marinade, combine:
1/2 tablespoon cuttlefish ink (bought on Amazon)
3 tablespoons coffee
2 teaspoons brown sugar
1 teaspoon Worcestershire sause
2 teaspoons salt
3 teaspoons garlic powder
mix well, then add 2 tablespoons of corn oil, and mix again.
Put a ~2 lb hunk of tri-tip (Costco) in a gallon-sized ziplock and add the marinade
spread the marinade all over the meat
refrigerate for 3 days, turning and rubbing the marinade into the meat a couple of times a day.
Scrape off most of the marinade (leaving some is fine)
Roast 45 min at 375F (same as for Fred’s instruction).
Thanks to the previous posters for ingredient ideas and thoughts.
Just a clarification – do you mean brewed coffee or something like ground coffee/espresso powder? I’m gonna try it! Thanks!
We used to live in the Bay Area and I LOVED Fred Steak.. Since moving away from California I can only dream of days gone bye, when I was able to drop by Schaub’s and one up to throw on the BBQ..
I am so excited to find a recipe online, but I don’t see measurements in your recipe, especially for the second set of ingredients. Is there anyway you can me an idea of how much to use?
Ah! A good question! I’d say in general, if making 2 cups total, about 1-2 Tablespoons of each. I’m really interested to hear back from people who can do side by side taste tests and weigh in on which ingredients work the best!
I made this again the other night and enjoyed it yet again. I used about 2-3 Tablespoons of each of the main ingredients and ~1 tsp. of the second set of ingredients to marinate one ~2.5 lb tri tip. I didn’t have ALL of the ingredients, but that’s OK I think. I paired it with more Asian sides this time (green beans with garlic & oyster sauce and cherry tomato salad) and it was delicious.
This marinade doesn’t become soild when frozen due to the wine, so make a large batch and store it in the freezer for quick flavor anytime.
I too have experimented with recipes to duplicate Fred’s. I started with the question, “what ingredients were readily available in the 1950’s?” The signature black color has been a persistent puzzle, especially in the way it is so watery on the butcher paper. I tried adding simple black food coloring for the last hours of the marinade time, and found a perfect match.
One detail I request from everyone experimenting with the recipes; please share your recipe and results. By doing so, in time, we will find the best recipe!
I have used this as a base for trying to duplicate Fred’s. I find the molasses makes it too sweet. You get enough from the sweet from the brown sugar and enough black from the coffee/vinegar/Worcestershire. It definitely needs a good amount of salt too, as Fred’s steaks are quite salty (I don’t think soy sauce gives the right flavor, so regular salt should be used).
I don’t think that I have found the proper duplicate, but it is still a damn good marinade.
Fred’s steak from Schaub’s is a sirloin, not tri-tip…. I’d love to know if anyone’s tried it with a different cut of meat?
In the immortal word of Otto West: Disappointed!
I tried the first one of these recipes. Not. Even. Close. Real Fred steaks are black, even before you cook them, and blacker afterwards. The marinade forms an almost crunchy shell around the steak when seared, and the flavor is distinctive (and amazing).
I marinated a tri-tip for 2 days in the ersatz marinade. It was more red coming out of the fridge after their two days in the sauce and definitely brown coming off the grill. Dark brown, but not close to black. And the taste? It’s good, but it’s not even close to Fred’s. It’s has a sour note, probably from the balsamic, and it’s sweeter than Fred’s. Also not as salty and definitely not as savory. No sign of that crunchy shell.
I’m fortunate because I can stop on the way home from work to get an authentic Fred’s. But I was hoping to get away from paying Schaub’s prices.
I guess I’ll try the next one on the list.
Thanks for sharing your notes, especially with fresh tastes of Fred’s for comparison. Sounds like more salt and less sour is the way to go. Squid ink is the likely source of blackness – especially if you think back to “1950.” I’m not sure that adds flavor though. How to get “crunchy” from a marinade though? Will have to think about that…
I’ve done a side-by-side taste of the first recipe and an authentic Schaub’s Fred steak. I’m disappointed to say, it’s not even close. The recipe here has sour notes that are not present in Fred’s, it’s not nearly salty enough, and it falls way short on the blackness or the crunchy nature it promotes on the seared surface of the steak. It’s a good recipe and makes a tasty steak, but I’m going to try the variants next.
I wonder if the “average recipe” approach pulled out too many souring agents – maybe cut back on black vinegar or coffee and/or wine. Again, with the “1950’s” thinking, they probably weren’t using black vinegar…
Daniel, have you tried any further recipes? I would love to replicate Fred’s steak without paying their high prices either!
No, but Edub below posted a much simpler recipe. And I’m going to try it.
Daniel, want to ship some across the country? Venmo or Paypal for your efforts!!
Yeah, I can’t really afford to get into that business, LOL. I offered to do it for a friend who lives in LA, but by the time we priced the steak, the shipping materials, the ice, and the postage, the estimate was way over $100.
Yeah, i would be paying way over $100…cuz I’d be asking for a minimum 10 lbs and probably closer to 15+. Go big or go home! If you change your mind, let me know!
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I too have experimented. I say use instant espresso powder instead of brewed-it will give darker color as will cocoa powder. If you really want it dark use squid ink, available in fish markets. A little goes a long way. To me there is a crunch from molasses or sugar as a crust……….hmmm maybe i’ll try again.
The steak marinade is far simple than anything you can find posted online. I’ve had the original hundreds of times (I know schaub personally), he hasn’t let go of the secret but I’ve damn near perfected it. It requires a tumbler to fully marinade and penetrate, otherwise a good 48hrs+ soak in a bag in the fridge will do.
Ingredients
Food grade activated charcoal powder
Garlic powder
Onion powder
Salt
Oil
It’s a wet marinade, mix the ingredients into a paste. Salt the raw meat, (plus add salt to marinade) coat the steak and let sit in fridge for 48hrs, or throw in a tumbler for 4-5 hours to marinade and tenderize. Gently wipe off extra and cook 350 degrees on grill offset cooking for 25-40 minutes depending on size of steak.
Has anyone else tried Edub’s recipe? Sure sounds a lot more simple!
I made my first attempt at Edub’s ingredients. It was good, but not exactly there yet. My ‘problem’ might be the proportions. Since Edub did not provide any, I just made a stab. I tried equal quantities of the charcoal, Garlic, onion, and salt., and 3x quantity oil (extra-virgin olive). This had a thick liquid texture that coated the sirloin nicely when I first applied it in a zip-lock bag. But once it got cold in the fridge, it turned thick and pasty, and would not stick to the meat. I tried ‘massaging’ the bags a couple times a day for 3 days to try to keep the meat coated. I got good transfer of saltiness to the meat, but not much black color or garlic/onion flavor. I think this thickness issue would be fixed by using a different oil that does not get solid at fridge temp. The steak was also a bit too salty to my taste, and I’m a salt fiend, so others might find it much too salty. Next time, I’ll try vegetable oil at maybe 4:1 next time, and less salt. I felt like it was missing some flavor note from authentic Fred’s, but that might have just been poor take up of the garlic and onion, so for my next attempt, I’m not going to add any ingredients – because what’s the penalty? I have to eat more steak?
So the next attempt will be:
1/4 cup Food grade charcoal power
1/4 cup garlic powder
1/4 cup onion powder
3/16 cut salt
1 cup vegetable oil
I’m also going to cook it wrapped in pink butcher paper to try to get a nice bark.
I’ll let you know.
My second attempt on a variation of EDub’s recipe tonight! Closer – not quite there yet.
For this try, I used the following proportions:
1/4 cup garlic powder
1/4 cup onion powder
1/4 cup sugar
1/4 cup food grade activated charcoal powder
3/16ths cup salt
1 1/4 cup safflower oil
The differences between this and my last attempt was a reduction of salt, the addition of sugar and substitution of safflower oil for olive oil, and in greater quantity. The change in oil kept the marinade liquid in the fridge (in a zip lock bag for 4 days), and so maintained better contact between the marinade and the meat while it was cold.
I marinated two 1.5 inch NY strips for 4 days, and cooked them to medium rare in my sous vide cooker (Mellow), then 4 minutes sear on each side in a heavy cast iron skillet I’d preheated to 500 degrees in the oven.I got a nice bark from the sear. Rested 5 minutes before slicing. The base flavors of the steak seemed very close to Fred’s. The saltiness is about right, but there is still at least one flavor element missing. I don’t know what it is. I think I’ll have to go back to Schaub’s for an authentic Fred’s to refresh my memory.
I tried Edubs recipe over the holidays when I found his post. I have been off and on trying to figure out this recipe over the last 5 years or so. It is by FAR the closest recipe so far. All the others posted online are nowhere close when you compare this to those. Like you, I am still working on dialing in the ratio of ingredients and am on my fourth iteration.
I think I can agree that it is missing “something” at this point, but until I feel I have completely dialed in the current ingredients I can’t be sure. I feel like that is how close it is. I will post here once I feel good about the ratio.
One thing I will say is that I have been working with a Beef Top Sirloin “Chateaubriand” cut from Whole Foods. I feel like it is the closest non-custom cut of meat to the sirloin cut Fred’s comes in. I am not sure if a NY strip would have the same flavor even if you applied the actual marinade to it.
Also from my experience, comparing Fred’s steak cooked on a grill to roasting it in the oven(I usually prefer grilling almost everything), I feel it comes out better in the oven. So I have been following the instructions that Fred’s Steak comes with for roasting and using the sirloin cut I mentioned above.
Guys? How are the ingredient ratio tweaks going?
I’ve been searching on and off years and super excited about his breakthrough. Edub seems to ha d got us on the right coarse. I didn’t even know activated charcoal was a thing that existed.
I’m happy to contribute, I live in Palo Alto, and can pick up from schaubs any time. I will do as many taste tests as needed.
What’s the best ratio so far? And what seems to be missing from a taste perspective?
I’ve done another iteration on EDub’s basis. Similar to before, but I added Paprika. This turned out to be a step away from the FS flavor profile. In fact, it kind of revealed that my earlier addition of sugar was probably a mistake. I also don’t think the charcoal is the source of Fred’s color. It just does not produce the same shade or degree of blackness. It’s also a little gritty. I’m going to try black food color or squid ink next. But I’m going to worry less about the color and more about the flavor for the next attempts.
So my closest so far is
1 part onion powder
1 part Garlic Powder
1 part activated charcoal
3/4 part salt
3 parts safflower oil (I think any neutral flavored oil that stayed liquid at fridge temps would work)
But as I said, I think it’s not quite there, something is missing. It’s not paprika ;). I’m going to experiment with the chili powder, coffee and maybe some lemon next.
Thanks Daniel.
My mom tried to replicate FS years ago. And it was simply Garlic, Soy and Brandi. Amazing flavor and there was a Hint of Fred’s in there.
Garlic is obvious.
I’m thinking Brandy might be the missing ingredient.
That being said, I haven’t tried any of these posted recipes yet so I’m just imagining the taste based off of the ingredients.
Regarding the grit on the charcoal, have you thought the blending the marinade before applying? Does the charcial bring a taste that contributes? Or just color? My charcoal arrives tomorrow.
I’m not 100% sure but I would like to suggest that someone try adding a teaspoon or two of Vegemite. It has a dark color and very salty taste that’s unique and could be the missing ingredient as I doubt anyone would think to try it or even knows what it is as it’s an Aussie staple. I can only find it at cost plus world market in my area.
I will be experimenting myself and will post back if I make any progress. This recipe needs to be shared with the world. I doubt it would affect their business as most people won’t deal with the effort or have enough money living in the bay area it’s easier to just buy.
i prefer a simple marinade that consists of lemon juice with lemon peel mixed in it (since it is far more natural than vinegar) and fine garlic paste along with black pepper and paprika not to mention some extra virgin olive oil and a bit of brewed tea. it is no coincidence that the word “steak” contains “tea” in its midst on a linguistic basis. coffee is too strong and too bitter a brew in my humble opinion. some teriyaki sauce and hot tabasco sauce would also not be amiss in this marinade. finally (how could i miss this one!) there is the pinch of baking soda or meat tenderizer that you just cannot do without. leave it in the fridge for approximately 6-8 hours in a sealed zip-lock bag and then take it out and grill over a steak pan. that’ll be good to go and yummy in my tummy!
Awesome! Thank you! But do you think you could provide quantities/proportions in the recipe?
I’m thinking that the charcoal, in addition to providing the color, might be contributing to the bark as well.
I don’t have any further recipe insight, but a do have a Fred steak tragedy to relate. I had guests coming over, so I bought 2 large Fred Steaks at Schaub’s, probably over 5 pounds together. Cost a small fortune!
A hour and a half or so before dinner, I started up the grill, and just before cooking, I laid the two steaks out on a cookie sheet on the kitchen table. I ran outside just for a sec, literallybinwas outsode less than a minute, to check the grill, and when I came back, only one steak remained on the sheet. There was not a trace of that second steak, but my big old hound dog Jeff looked very pleased with himself.
Hi All, Thanks for all of the comments on your attempts at replicating Fred’s Steak! I’ve added a flyer handout from Schaub’s itself about the steak to the post above just FYI – no extra hints to glean from it however. Interesting about the charcoal attempts and Edub’s comments about the vacuum tumbler. I am guessing squid ink provides the blackness and, who knows, maybe that missing flavor (many cuisines add a dash of some form of fish extract to enhance flavor). I’ve also written about another famous marinated meat called “Cardiff Crack” that is known to use vacuum tumbling to marinate the meat (https://gardenandeats.wordpress.com/2017/01/18/deconstructing-cardiff-crack/). Vacuum tumbling is known to really change the consistency of the meat as well as provide marinade penetration and is very hard to replicate at home. I’ve also noticed that there are several more Fred’s Steak recipes on-line since this original posting – including one’s with squid ink – find one with photos and you will see the color is dead on. Please keep on posting your attempts – I think we are getting close!
I feel the pain of the post about someones dog maybe eating the main course of a planned dinner event. LOL
Growing up in Menlo Park and living in almost the backyard of Stanford University and the shopping center. I remember buying and eating that blackened steak and so loving it many times.
In the late 90’s my family moved across the Bay to Fremont. We had neighbors who loved to grill all the time. So I bought some ” Fred’s steak”, put it in a clear plastic bag and gave it to my neighbors wife for him to grill. She being a sneaky person and wanting to surprise him, put it way back in the fridge kinda hiding it from him. He saw it oneday when no one else was home.
A few days later…… his wife asks all the family members if anyone saw the “blackened steak” in the fridge.The husband sheepishly answers her. Seeing how far back in the fridge it was, thinking it was really old meat so black and all. He threw it out with the garbage.
Oh well. Just goes to show how people are conditioned to eating “RED MEAT.”
So sad! LOL. Thanks for sharing. Lesson learned – don’t hide the Fred’s!
Has anyone tried the dry rub meathod with finely ground espresso?
In my opinion the recipe has to be simple, with just a few ingridients and keeping in mind that the black color is unintensional. if it is black is because the ingridient that makes it black is the most important and the one that gives it the most flavor, otherwise why make it black? Black is not a color anybody would want on a steak. So it makes not sense adding food color or something else just to match the color. I also think that the ingredients have to be common and make sense. For axample, I don’t think that squid ink or all the asian sweet condiments or even black vinager make sense. I don´t know if black instant coffe it’s the correct ingredient, but it makes more sense to me than chili powder or Worcestershire sauce. Now, charcoal powder? Who would think that adding charcoal to their meat is a good idea in the first pplace?
It seems to me that we have to be practical. I imagin Fred, in the 50’s prepariing a marinade for a sunday BBQ with whatever ingridients he had at hand, resulting in what would become the Fred Steak.
Trust me, it has to be more simple than that, and the key ingridient is the one that makes it black.
It could be as little as one or two ingredients. I could be Black trouffles or black mole for all I know. Could someone remind me what does it smell like when raw?
It is for sure activated charcoal powder… You dont need a lot of it but it gives it an identical taste and look to Freds.
What kind of Charcoal powder is the right one, because I’ve found from coconut, from vegetables, from bamboo, etc. Thanks
The one I used was derived from hardwood and made by FineVine. I cant find it on Amazon anymore but here is the exact one I used:
https://patientsvitamins.com/product/activated-hardwood-charcoal-powder-made-in-usa-food-grade-for-detox-teeth-whitening-face-mask-helps-digestion-bug-bites-treats-poisoning-and-wounds/?gclid=EAIaIQobChMI_NGspe2S5wIVjx-tBh012QmMEAkYBSABEgJZu_D_BwE
Great, thanks a bunch!
Yeah, that was my dog. At least in my case *some ody* enjoyed it! LOL
Ok, so i’m clear on the position that charcoal is the magic ingredient, but I just saw a recipe today about a black garlic and I was wondering could this be it? It just still makes no sense to me the Charcoal, specially in the 50s. Any way, heres the link for the Black Garlic. You be the judge. https://youtu.be/w7An6nWb-PI
thats not it. It seems like this recipe was well before black garlic became in vogue. I make and sell it as part of my farm. There are many recipes for black garlic and many are awesome Some good recipes at NJGarlic.com under the black garlic tab
I’m going to stick by my squid ink hypothesis for the black coloring, although I haven’t tried it. Schaub’s sells fish and squid – and squid ink is supposed to be delectable and certainly an ingredient with history. I agree that things like black garlic and charcoal are more recent fads, not found in the recipes of old…. has anyone tried real squid ink, in anything?
I tried squid ink and didn’t like it. It gave a fishy flavor and not much color to the meat.
I can’t imagine Fred using any of the fancy ingredients listed above. I’ll bet he got everything he needed in Eddie’s Northside Market. I’m sure there is a simple answer, but we may never figure it out. Meanwhile, he is looking down at us and laughing!
I ordered small, single use squid ink packs (~1 tsp) to test. First I used one to make fresh pasta. The smell was strong, not entirely pleasant, and I worried the pasta would taste fishy. But once cooked I have to say I might only make pasta with squid ink now – the flavor was immensely subtle and acted more like an umami agent than a fish flavor… my next test was a Lock Down Tri Tip. People – I think I’ve found it. That distinctive Fred’s flavor has to be squid ink. I haven’t had Fred’s for quite awhile so I’m really hoping someone can do a taste test. The recipe I used was based on the simple one above for 2 lbs: 2 tsp each salt, garlic powder, onion powder, black pepper, paprika, then a squid ink pack then (because I’m an idiot) 1/2 tsp each cumin and dry mustard all mashed together to make a thick rub with 1 TBS olive oil. I marinated for a few days then baked for 40 min (135 deg) at 375. I’m thinking you could leave out the paprika, cumin and mustard. But, even if not authentic, delicious!
As I said above, I tried squid ink and did not like the fishy flavory it imparted, without giving much more than a gray tint to the meat. I’m still stumped on the color. I tried powdered charchoal (food grade) and didn’t get the color either.
I do think there is a danger to using too much squid ink. I’m not endorsing this product in any way – but this is what I ordered and used – 1 pack (2 grams) cuttlefish ink – on a 1.5 lb tri tip – with S&P and granulated garlic and onion. Anyone else have success with squid/cuttlefish ink? https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00LF62QZK/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1
I just called Schaub’s and they do NOT ship Fred’s steak so you have to get someone you know in the area to buy it and ship it to you. 😦
I really think its activated charcoal. Someone should call and say they are allergic to squid ink and see if they sell you the steak.
Does activated charcoal have a “taste” or why is it that people use it?
Incorrect. I was a line cook at Face Book in Palo Alto and the recipe was passed to my head chef personally. It is squid ink, onion powder, salt and garlic.
The activated charcoal was very similar to Freds but this weekend we tried the squid ink (powder) and it did indeed taste almost identical to Freds. Richard thanks for the tip.
I also agree – we used a squid in paste with just S&P and garlic & onion powders. It’s easy and a real Fred replicate! Thanks so much for confirming my suspicions!
So question; Are there variations to squid ink? I tried cuttlefish ink (not sure that’s the same thing). It did not produce a deep black color (instead kind of an unappetizing gray), and it imparted a fishy taste that was definitely not part of the FS flavor profile. I have tried the salt, pepper, garlic and onion recipe, and it was close but not quite there (side by side taste test with ‘real’ FS). But in the post with that recipe, there were no proportions. Do you have the proportions for these ingredients?
Do you know the proportions?
Proportions? squid ink, onion powder, salt and Garlic (Minced, powder, crushed?)
How long in the marinade?
Ok… giving this a go:
2 table spoons garlic power
2 table spoons granulated onion
2 table spoons kosher salt
2 teaspoons squid / cuddle fish ink
It’s got a deep black color like Fred’s. I’m marinating it for 2 days and will report back.
Here’s a picture – https://cloud.box.com/s/ht0uasbkvtqfrl6fpi13iwd3ljn9spnw
That picture looks like Fred’s! I’ll bet it’s good. Do report back.
Ok. Following up on my cook.
Again recipe was:
2lb Tri tip
2 tbl spoon garlic powder
2 tbl spoon granulated onion
2 tbl spoon kosher salt
2 tsp squid ink – https://www.amazon.com/dp/B073ZK2MK5/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_i_ieRBFbFR4DRYB
Marinated 1 day
Baked 375 for 40 minutes
Review:
Color: was deep black and perfect
Texture: just a tad too slim
Taste: nope 😦 not Freds. The squid ink made it too “fishy” it’s very possible that I used too much squid ink. I think a little goes a LONG way, but a previous post here mentioned a “grey” color so maybe I overcompensated. It smelled a bit fishy, and it tasted fishy, and was a bit runny on the plate. Not the right flavor. What a shame
Here are all the pictures:
https://cloud.box.com/s/jif894tjiqfwlv95ldrai9bo7qmbmy3q
A few thoughts:
1) I really want to believe it’s these ingredients, especially from the FB line cook’s insights. I know Mark Zuck is a big fan of Fred’s steaks so it’s believable he commissioned the recipe for employees.
2) MAYBE the squid ink powder is more of what we are looking for (instead of the Liquid), maybe it’s not so fishy? Since it’s a powder?
3) I’ve tried this hardcore black rub, which is based off of activated charcoal and it had an uncanny resemblance to Fred’s – https://www.amazon.com/dp/B08D8Q4KQX/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_i_nkRBFbNJNSXEP
4) I have activate charcoal ready to experiment with, but I really don’t want to believe this is the missing ingredient, it’s way too new age fringe for a recipe from the 50’s.
I don’t plan to run another experiment for a while as my wife was not thrilled with her fishy steak dinner tonight.
I live a mile away from schaubs so I plan to begin A/B testing eventually.
Thanks for the notes! I used 1/4 the amount of ink for the same sized piece of meat and thought it was great. So perhaps for others trying I would recommend starting with just a bit of ink and trying more next time if you don’t get the Fred’s taste. Curious why you used 2 tablespoons of salt on 2 lbs of meat? Seems very salty or maybe it comes off when cooked.
This is really exciting! I do think we’ve cracked the nut on Fred’s secret ingredient. As far as the final proportions and technique – please continue share your experiments. I’ve made it 3x now also going with a 1:1:1 salt : garlic powder : onion powder and applying at 3/4 tsp SALT / lb of meat. I didn’t buy squid ink powder but instead found these little 4g pouches (~1/4 tsp?) of “Cuttlefish Ink” (made by Nortindal in Spain – no affiliation) that are liquid. I’ve just added all of one pouch on each steak and they are as black as can be (side note – I’ve found the ink doesn’t stain my hands or sink if quickly washed away – also Daniel Madison wondering why your’s was gray?). I’ve marinated the meat for 1-2 days but really it’s that outer crust that gives it a great Fred’s flavor. I also put the marinade on one and threw it in the freezer for future testing. First bite from my kids brings a “this is good!”. With some horseradish cream sauce I can eat this all day. Would love folks comments on what and where and who makes the squid ink they are trying. Thanks everyone!
How are you apply the rub? First the squid ink all over the meat, then the salt/garlic/onion? Or mix all the rub ingredients together first?
I rubbed the salt/garlic/onion powder mix on the meat and then rubbed in the ink. The ink I use is liquid and a bit a of mess to mix it with the salt first.
3/4 tsp SALT / lb of meaT or is it 3/4 cup?
3/4 tsp SALT / lb of meat
Is that 3/4 tablespoons?
nope, 3/4 teaspoons per pound of meat – so 1.5 tsps for 2 lbs meat etc.
nope, 3/4 teaspoons per pound of meat – so 1.5 tsps for 2 lbs meat etc.
It’s been kind of a while, so I don’t remember the brand of ink I used, except that it was ‘cuttlefish ink’ and it came in little tear-off packets. I also don’t remember exactly how I applied it at this point. I don’t remember rubbing it into the meat, so maybe that’s it, color wise – I think I mixed it into my version of the marinade. As I said, I thought it gave the meat an unpleasant fishy taste that was not ‘Fred’s-like’ to me. But given your comments, I might try it again your way.
Who lives close enough to ship some Fred’s across the country? Would be a great side hustle. Or just the nicest thing ever to do!! Venmo, paypal to pay you for it!
Seemed strange that Schaub’s wouldn’t ship, but I just called them and they said, no they do not do mail order. Missed opportunity for sure!
I’ve heard it is because they would need to meet a whole new set of regulations to ship meat. Not sure if that is true as so many restaurants/food establishments now do ship. And there are services such as Goldbelly that have contracted with many, many places to ship food around the country so it can be done. That’s why I’m thinking it would be a great side hustle for someone living in the area. Set it up so you ship once/month; one trip to Schaubs, put multiple packages together, one trip to shipper. Get paid via paypal or venmo to keep it easy.
I have a friend that wanted me to ship some to him. When I totted up the cost of a single shipment, it came out to more than $100. Cost of meat, ice packs, rush shipping, etc. if you did it as a business, that would likely add more overhead. Fred steak is outstanding, but I’m not going to pay $100+ for a fee servings.
Maybe not the meat itself, but they could sell the rub. they could sell the rub and one could just get the meat with the butcher of preference and that’s it!
Sorry to get pedantic for a sec, more likely a marinade than a rub, but… I get your point – I don’t know why they have not bottled the stuff! I presume it didn’t make economic sense for them to do it – or perhaps another reason? Maybe it’s not that simple to reproduce the taste, requiring marinating and rubbing or something?
…and I should not be so pedantic after all – it could be a rub, I guess – people seem to have some success with rubbing.
I’m happy with my reverse engineered faux-Fred. Thanks to everyone for all the insight and discussion.
Here is the recipe:
1 2-3 lb tri-tip (from Costco)
1/2 tablespoon cuttlefish ink (from Amazon)
3 tablespoons drip coffee
2 tablespoons corn oil
2 teaspoons brown sugar
1 teaspoon worcestershire sauce
2 teaspoons salt
3 teaspoons garlic powder
Mix the marinade together (add the oil last), then add it to the meat in a ziplock
Refrigerate for a 2 – 4 days, rub/turn when you think of it
We ran a blind teaste off against genuine Fred in January (2022), and the real and faux were very close. Previous versions had more salt, but were not quite right.
Hi! Just wanted to say thank you for this – my grandmother loves Fred’s and I wanted to make some for her birthday but, alas, she lives in Michigan and not in the Bay! I made this recipe exactly as written and it was very, very close but a tiny bit sweet – for my second go-around I halved the brown sugar and used a 1:1 mixture of garlic and onion powder instead of just garlic (inspired by an earlier comment). Granted, I haven’t had a real Fred in a while, but it tasted EXACTLY how I remembered. Hope this helps someone else out!!
To David or anyone else who’s had a successful attempt…I tried this recipe and while the look was dead on, and the taste was close, it did have a bit of a fishy undertone. So I’m hoping for some insight into where I could’ve gone wrong:
+ Is there a particular brand of cuttlefish (or squid) ink folks have had success with?
+ On the coffee front, any guidance on dark/light? a brand that really worked?
+After marination, did you go direct to grill or did you wipe off the excess marinade? How aggressively? I feel like Fred’s doesn’t come wet so should I dry fully or even let it sit for a bit to dry out?
+ For the marinade, did you stir in the oil or bland / emulsify it?